The Science Fiction of Cry Your Name

n The Science Fiction of Cry Your Name

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The Science Fiction of Cry Your Name
Copyright Š Fan Forum 2001. All Rights Reserved.

Thread started by LSS, Dr. of Theology at Gonzaga University in Washington

Posted 04-23-2001 08:29 PM
LSS
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Posts: 1617 Registered: Feb 00
Whew--what an emotional episode! Although Cry Your Name focused mainly on the relationships and the tragedy of Alex's demise, there were a few interesting SF tidbits to digest... 1) US vs. THEM. Not since Destiny have the teens been so split. Now, however, a more nefarious suspicion seems the rule of the day. Is Liz right? Did knowing Max prove hazardous to Alex's health? 2) BINARY CODES AND CREDIT CARDS. In the closing frames of this episode, the delivery boy appears at the Crashdown, complete with the rejected credit card form. Where the signature should have been is a series of zeros and ones. Didn't that look like a binary code to you? Any guesses as to its significance? 3) NOTHING IS EVERY WHAT IT SEEMS. Accident? Suicide? Or Homicide? Who is correct? Why did Alex question why everything had to be a lie? Was he talking about life in general--an expression of existential angst? Or should we see something more sinister here? [careful--no spoilers please] And what is the significance of that picture? Why did it show up in the wreck minus Alex image? Did the rip reflect an act of despair? Or frustrated anger? Liz notes that where the aliens are concerned nothing is often what it seems...but just where are the smoke and mirrors in this eppy?Are they in the cause of Alex's death...or in the "fact" of it? And where are the other aliens on earth...should we trust this dramatic lull in earth's alien population--or should we see their hand in the arrangement of that smoke and mirrors? Roads to go and Promises to keep--sigh--why do I think that road will lead us all to places we NEVER wanted to go? Well folks...what do you think? LSS

Posted 04-23-2001 08:59 PM
Qfanny
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Posts: 1292 Registered: Jul 00
LSS! Thank you for starting this thread again. I don't know if you were aware, but I was present for the shooting of the funeral scenes, wrecking yard, and crash scenes. I've known for the last two months this was going to be THE EPISODE of the season. Frankly, I like the US v. THEM angle. It's new and refreshing. I do think Liz is right about the picture and the binary code meaning something. It's odd that it would be binary. Like math, I believe binary could be a univerisal language. Perhaps necessary to bridge two different computer systems together. My dad used to program in binary, so I am more likely to think of binary as a form of programming. ------------------From NebraskaQfanny/MOB14Liz is not an alienApril 28th Kansas City Gathering

Posted 04-23-2001 09:00 PM
Qfanny
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Posts: 1292 Registered: Jul 00
Does anyone think it odd that Alex has a credit card for a Junior in high school? ------------------From NebraskaQfanny/MOB14Liz is not an alienApril 28th Kansas City Gathering

Posted 04-23-2001 09:06 PM
Qfanny
Crazed Fan
Posts: 1292 Registered: Jul 00
Sorry to post again. What does everything think about Max not being able to save Alex???? I have my own ideas myself - I reject the FrankenAlex theory - but what do you think? ------------------From NebraskaQfanny/MOB14Liz is not an alienApril 28th Kansas City Gathering

Posted 04-23-2001 09:06 PM
plumeria

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Posts: 4181 Registered: May 00
Could have been his dad's credit card account, but in Alex's name. My mom has done that -- given me a card in my name but under her account for emergencies. I wrote down the binary code (I think I got it all) and my husband tried to dissect it. When translated to a single number, it's a 6-digit figure. (He unfortunatley didn't write it down, or I'd tell you what it is) -- it didn't ring any bells. When broken down into ascii numbers, it supposedly is 57 19 89, but hubby didn't have the translation code for what 3 letters those numbers would represent. Any other ways of dissecting the binary code? This is the code I wrote down, BTW -- 11100100100111011001 -- is that correct? Any theories as to what message Alex might have been trying to convey? I definitely don't think it was suicide. I've known for at least a month that Alex would die, only because I stumbled across the spoiler by accident -- I hate spoilers and avoid them like the plague, and knowing this in advance was killing me. I'm glad it's over. ------------------Plu's Fic Draco: A cold-blooded piece of toast (DS)

Posted 04-23-2001 09:11 PM
plumeria

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Posts: 4181 Registered: May 00
About Max not being able to save Alex... Well, Max hasn't ever tried to heal someone who's already dead, so it seemed unreasonable to expect for him to do so now. But otherwise, I think perhaps he was just too afraid and freaked out -- like he told Tess. And that hampered his abilities.

Posted 04-23-2001 09:13 PM
justsmile
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Posts: 2920 Registered: Aug 00
Gender: F
HELLO I've never posted here before Thing's I noticed: When Valenti was going to the accident the sound in the car was just like the sound when the humans disappeared in Wipe Out. Also when Hansen and Valenti blocked the ambulance as it left it said bulance 8 or balance 8 justsmile ------------------ROSWELL DOOMED?

Posted 04-23-2001 09:15 PM
LSS
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1617 Registered: Feb 00
Hi QFanny! You saw this eppy being filmed? What fun!!! You mentioned the binary code and computers. Did it strike you odd the repeated mention of "cold"? The food was cold (because the delivery boy was late)...but Alex's reply concerning cold seemed to imply something else--something about Alex himself. And Max mentions

Alex being cold--but of course one might expect that of a corpse. Codes/Computers/Cold...if this were a regular SF novel I would be wondering at this point if "Alex" was indeed our Alex. And I would be wondering if that file contained evidence NOT of a depressed teen, but of an Alex who was not what he seemed. But this is Roswell, and concerning Alex I am almost spoiler free... As for credit cards...I hate to say it, but high school seniors are given cards by their parents with secondary signing status. But why sign like that--unless it was a glitch in programming? Or some message? Any ideas? LSS

Posted 04-23-2001 09:20 PM
LSS
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Posts: 1617 Registered: Feb 00
quote:
Originally posted by justsmile: HELLO I've never posted here beforeThing's I noticed:When Valenti was going to the accident the sound in the car wasjust like the sound when the humans disappeared in Wipe Out.Also when Hansen and Valenti blocked the ambulance as it left itsaid bulance 8 or balance 8justsmile

Hi justsmile! Welcome to the SF of [episode] threads! I didn't notice the sound--any idea what it might signify? As for the number eight...before tonight we had 4 teens and 4 aliens...but of course, that is different now...sniff! LSS

Posted 04-23-2001 09:23 PM
plumeria

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Posts: 4181 Registered: May 00
quote:
Originally posted by LSS: ...if this were a regular SF novel I would be wondering at thispoint if "Alex" was indeed our Alex. And I would be wondering ifthat file contained evidence NOT of a depressed teen, but of anAlex who was not what he seemed.

My thoughts, exactly. Something seemed odd there. As for the "cold" references -- hmmm... I didn't think about that. Hmmm.... ------------------Plu's Fic Draco: A cold-blooded piece of toast (DS)

Posted 04-23-2001 09:24 PM
Qfanny
Crazed Fan
Posts: 1292 Registered: Jul 00
Well, I don't think there's a relationship with colds/corpses/computers in the script. However, it could be that the word cold was coming up because the cast was suffering from the Roswell siffles that week. Apparantly, the ringleader was JB but who cares. Binary programming is a series of number of 0 and 1. The computer understands only two things. On and off. So what binary does is give a sequence of 0s and 1s to translate a b c into words. eg 01
is a 01
0 is b 101 is c, etc. (I hope this is right, it's been a while.) If you look at the binary code on the reciept, it could mean anything, but to me the series of 1's and 0's have no other function than to be translated by a computer function. Perhaps they need to plug that numbers into the granolith. ------------------From NebraskaQfanny/MOB14Liz is not an alienApril 28th Kansas City Gathering

Posted 04-23-2001 09:29 PM
justsmile
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Posts: 2920 Registered: Aug 00
Gender: F
quote:
Originally posted by LSS: Hi justsmile!Welcome to the SF of [episode] threads! I didn't notice thesound--any idea what it might signify?As for the number eight...before tonight we had 4 teens and 4aliens...but of course, that is different now...sniff!LSS

Or 4 aliens and their 4 mates? I don't know maybe they're forshadowing or want us to rewatch... someone mentioned on another thread that In Wipe Out Alex mentioned cold food just like tonites ep. justsmile thanks for the welcome ------------------ROSWELL DOOMED?

Posted 04-23-2001 09:31 PM
belle_dreamer
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Posts: 5 Registered: Apr 2001
Gender: F
This Alex wasn't our Alex. I refuse to admit hes dead!

Posted 04-23-2001 09:32 PM
MissLParker
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 393 Registered: Nov 2000 Your PC communicates and processes information in a binary language of zeros and ones, where each group of seven to 16 characters corresponds to one letter, numeral, or symbol in a human language. A program originates as a programmer's source code and gets translated and compiled into a binary language the computer understands.This came from a site that I was reading. I not disputing that Alex was very smart but I don't think they offer binary language in HS. Pretty cool.

Posted 04-23-2001 09:35 PM
BehrFan
Addicted Fan
Posts: 945 Registered: Dec 99
quote:
Originally posted by Qfanny: Well, I don't think there's a relationship withcolds/corpses/computers in the script. However, it could be thatthe word cold was coming up because the cast was suffering fromthe Roswell siffles that week. Apparantly, the ringleader was JBbut who cares.Binary programming is a series of number of 0 and 1. The computerunderstands only two things. On and off. So what binary does isgive a sequence of 0s and 1s to translate a b c into words. eg 01
is a 01
0 is b 101 is c, etc. (I hope this is right, it's been awhile.)If you look at the binary code on the reciept, it could meananything, but to me the series of 1's and 0's have no otherfunction than to be translated by a computer function. Perhapsthey need to plug that numbers into the granolith.

OMB, what if you are right? What if they can "plug" that number into the granolith and that's how they are able to "go home" as hinted at in the promos.

Posted 04-23-2001 09:46 PM
dcactress

Fan Forum Elite
Posts: 3436 Registered: Aug 2000 Gender: F
quote:
Originally posted by Qfanny: Does anyone think it odd that Alex has a credit card for a Juniorin high school?

Not really. Most kids at my school have their own, simply for expenses (gas, clothes, food). I found this Binary code site: Binary Don't know if it means anything though. dae

Posted 04-23-2001 09:52 PM
SaveFerrisBueller
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 179 Registered: Nov 2000 I posted this on the general discussion board, but I thought I should post it here and add that since ASCII is in 8 bits it can be assumed that there are 4 zeros at the beginning and it is divided into three symbols. I'm no computer genius or anything, but I looked in my book for a class I took and what I got out of the binary code was a musical note, ♫, the symbol with the A and E squished together, Ć, and a backwards L, ┘. Does that mean anything to anyone??? I told you I was no genius.

Posted 04-23-2001 10:20 PM
BayouBabe
Fan in Training
Posts: 20 Registered: Jan 2001
I'm getting frustrated with this binary code thing. The numbers total 20, which is not divisible by eight, the length of numbers it takes for a letter. I was always taught that A=01000001B=01000010C=01000100 ...and so on and so forth. But Alex's numbers start with 1, so there begins my confusion. I looked up another set of coding which uses series of *7* numbers to one letter, and I got that 1110010=R The only thing I can't figure out, if the first letter is "R" (which I'm COMPLETELY unsure of), then what letter starts with 0 in this code? None. And I'm back to square one again. Literally.

Posted 04-23-2001 10:48 PM
Hooked
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Posts: 484 Registered: Oct 2000 Gender: F
I am going crazy about this binary code too. Unfortunately I don't have any answers yet. I do like the theories about this not being our Alex. Maybe our Alex never came back from Sweden. ------------------"I know you're hooked, I can see it in your eyes."Judy, OTOBehr Junkie

Posted 04-23-2001 11:06 PM
Hooked
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Posts: 484 Registered: Oct 2000 Gender: F
OK, here is a really long shot. Convert the binary number to hexadecimal using 4 bit characters. You come up with:0E 49 D9 (Actually the first 0 was added in) Next, convert these "numbers" into ascii (US version with latin characters) equivalent. That gives us "shift - I - U grave" The grave is the name of an accent-diagonally upper left down to lower right which would go over the U. These are the ascii assignments for keyboard symbols. So that is what the computer would call the keyboard keys. the shift would be the shift on the keyboard. Now that is rather ominous. Could this mean that Alex has been switched with someone else? Maybe the real Alex never came back from Sweden? Any thoughts? ------------------"I know you're hooked, I can see it in your eyes."Judy, OTOBehr Junkie [This message has been edited by Hooked (edited 04-24-2001).]

Posted 04-23-2001 11:07 PM
Barrybud
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Posts: 425 Registered: Apr 00
Hi All, I normally lurk through this thread. This binary stuff is going to kill us until we can decode it! I have searched the Net for a while and can only come up with sites that covert TO binary, not the other way!!!! ------------------BarryIt must have been a mind warp! Get a new excuse!Aplscr BBB Catfightr Hussy OTO H-MOB

Posted 04-24-2001 12:16 AM
shapeshifter
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1765 Registered: May 2000 shapeshifter Earth to Spaceship Nemo, come in Nemo, do you read us? About the binary code: Alex is a musician. Could the few letters be the notes to a song whose words would be a clue? Maybe the song he wrote for Isabel (see silverhandprint.com) Maybe I'm in denial, but I don't think Alex is dead. Liz seems to say that the binary code is the Frost poem line, "miles to go before I sleep." Hmmm... Could Alex be saving Isabel from Kvar? Could the binary code be Morse code? [This message has been edited by shapeshifter (edited 04-24-2001).]

Posted 04-24-2001 12:26 AM
Hooked
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Posts: 484 Registered: Oct 2000 Gender: F
I found this post on the general discussion thread (part I) posted by MiSToCles

quote:
Hi guys, Has anyone posted about the credit card signature? Well...I don'thave time to read through the thread tonight (sorry!) and my comp.is dying...so sorry if someone already posted this then sorry forjust stating what has already been stated... 11100100100111011001It's binary code! I think what Alex signed in is binary code...Ifit is..then I think the numbers if they're going from left toright..they are 14 - 4 - 9 - 13 - 9. 1449139. If they're fromright to left it's 9 - 11 - 9 - 2 - 7. 911927. Fun. That isprobably so whacked outly wrong or something. But that's what Igot. 911..hmmm...I don't know. Somehow you can change binary codeinto letters..I know you can, I just don't know how. Ohwell..someone can go from there...Later.Mistocles

My husband came up with the first number also, but didn't try it backwards

------------------"I know you're hooked, I can see it in your eyes."Judy, OTOBehr Junkie

Posted 04-24-2001 01
:05 AM
Nemo
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Posts: 789 Registered: Dec 99
Gender:M
quote:
Originally posted by MissLParker: [B]...not disputing that Alex was very smart but I don't thinkthey offer binary language in HS.

They didn't when I was there (35 years ago) but I had picked it up by then anyway, and I would guess Alex did too, from what we have seen of his technical work.

Posted 04-24-2001 01
:15 AM
Luna G
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 132 Registered: Nov 2000quote:
Originally posted by LSS: Liz notes that where the aliens are concerned nothing is oftenwhat it seems...but just where are the smoke and mirrors in thiseppy? Are they in the cause of Alex's death...or in the "fact" of it?And where are the other aliens on earth...should we trust thisdramatic lull in earth's alien population--or should we see theirhand in the arrangement of that smoke and mirrors? LSS

I hate to say this, because the Isabel/Alex dream sequences were very sweet, BUT: Could the dreams have actually been fed to her by an outside source? I tend to assume that the dupes have similar powers to the podsters, so if Lonnie is out there and part of the evil aliens team, then it's possible that Lonnie also can dreamwalk, or even alter dreams. It may be that these are just harmless dreams, but it seems as if they are having a greater impact on the choices Isabel is making than anything or anyone else. Whatever plot is going on, and whoever is behind it, they're playing deep, like a plant underground sending up little tentacles in a bunch of different places. We may not see where they come together until the finale. BTW, Rah to the threesome of Liz, Kyle & Maria. Just like in Wipe Out, they know when it's time to go their own way. ------------------LunaYou've got to have a plan. Unless it is the Destiny Plan.

Posted 04-24-2001 01
:29 AM
Nemo
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Posts: 799 Registered: Dec 99
Gender:M
For the string of binary digits, I got the same as plumeria posted. The first thing I tried was converting to hex, and got E 49 D9, same as Hooked. (It comes out even (20 binary digits are just enough for 5 hex characters, none left over, encouraging us to think that this may be the right way to start.) That's as far as I got before comparing notes with you all, and I especially admire the progress made by Hooked -- the "shift - I - U grave" sounds relevant enough that it could be the next step on the way to a solution.shapeshifter, so far I don't see any connection with music (or Morse code), though I'll think about it some more. But for now I'm betting on Hooked's idea, and it leads me to wonder whether you are right in thinking that Alex isn't really dead. Maybe he too has miles to go before he sleeps in that sense. I like your conjecture that he may be looking out for Isabel.P.S. I may be away for a day or two, with a school field trip, but I'll get back when I can. Perhaps you'll have it solved by then.[This message has been edited by Nemo (edited 04-24-2001).]

Posted 04-24-2001 07:52 AM
LimeWarp
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Posts: 403 Registered: Mar 00
No one has mentioned mind warping. Does anyone think any mindwarping was going on in this episode? Is it possible Tess had anything to do with furthering the rift between the humans and aliens? I can think of several scenes in which the chararacters reactions seemed very off. I also thought the scene with Max in the van trying to heal Alex was strange. It's hard to conjecture on something we really didn't see, but there seemed to be something very off about that van scene.Interesting theories, etc. on the binary code.------------------"If things go really well, maybe we'll upgrade to #3 pencils." Ed to Shirley

Posted 04-24-2001 08:37 AM
iluvm&m
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Posts: 504 Registered: Nov 2000 Gender: F
quote:

Originally posted by plumeria: My thoughts, exactly. Something seemed odd there. As for the "cold" references -- hmmm... I didn't think about that.Hmmm....

Plumeria Alex is not the only person to mention the cold. In The Convention, when Valenti is talking to his dad about Hubble, Valenti Sr. says: "It's freezing in here. They're trying to kill me." (courtesy Crashdown transcripts). Maybe there is more to the being cold than meets the eye.

------------------"Welcome to the ever-burgeoning "I know an alien" club." - NacedoCandyclanner, Dreamer, CHADDS

Posted 04-24-2001 08:40 AM
estherterrestrial
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Posts: 151 Registered: May 00
quote:

Originally posted by shapeshifter: Liz seems to say that the binary code is the Frost poem line,"miles to go before I sleep." Hmmm...

It's been years since I've taken English, so I may be way off base here, but I thought that maybe the sequence of 0s and 1s represented stressed and unstressed symbols in the line of Frost poetry that Liz quoted? Weren't they all studying for an English test? If so, it would make since that she and Alex would have memorized the meter of the same line of the same poem. Otherwise, how would the code have any meaning to Liz (or his other friends)? I doubt that Liz knows much about binary code? Just an idea. Any English majors out there?

Posted 04-24-2001 08:53 AM
Granolith
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Posts: 324 Registered: Oct 2000 Gender: F
Hi. The binary code thing made me come lurk in here.I like the cold references. I never thought about that. They could mean nothing, but Frost is another cold reference.Keep up the good work and crack the code for me. I really wanted it to say "Khivar".

Posted 04-24-2001 09:07 AM
MissLParker
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Posts: 394 Registered: Nov 2000 Here is a binary translator. http://www.theinfo.org/programs/binary/ be back later.

Posted 04-24-2001 09:11 AM
SaveFerrisBueller
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 181 Registered: Nov 2000 The Binary code is very rhythmic, but that particular Frost poem is a simple iambic meter of unstressed/stressed 4 times in each line. But someone suggested that it may be a song that Alex wrote, so maybe it's the rhythm of that song.

Posted 04-24-2001 09:19 AM
dae
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Posts: 236 Registered: Feb 2001
Gender: F
Binary codes cannot only symbolize letters, but numbers too. So, the binary code could be a longistude and latitude, which is my little theory, and that poem is symbolic, saying that Liz is going to that place. But, this is only my theory, it could be seriously wrong.------------------Maria:This is your only phone call isn't it?Micheal:YeahMaria: Awww,(hangs up)

Posted 04-24-2001 09:40 AM
BayouBabe
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Posts: 20 Registered: Jan 2001
I don't think Liz meant at all that the series of digits translated into a line from the Frost poem. I think she saw it as a *clue*, still not quite sure of what it all means, but now she is more certain of her theory. I think her quoting "I have promises to keep/ And miles to go before I sleep" was just a sort of reiteration of her promise to Alex to find out exactly what's going on.

Posted 04-24-2001 10:14 AM
rozwelgirle2
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Posts: 501 Registered: Nov 2000 Gender: F
I think it was a mind warp. Keep in mind that the ultimate plan was for the Royal Four to go home...not stay on earth for ever.I think someone was upset that Alex and Isabel were starting a relationship again, and this would not do. The poem by Frost talks of a man who know's he's going to die *miles to go before I sleep* (death) he has unfinished business. Alex must have realized that he was in danger at some point and driving to go and tell the others. I think this was why he was killed. I also believe that someone trying to pull the Aliens back on track and work on going home. Someone is messing with their happiness. Slim evidence I know...

------------------How can I be a wacky sidekick to someone who is already wacky ?MOB28(wb5/01)

Posted 04-24-2001 11:10 AM
LSS
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1618 Registered: Feb 00
quote:

Originally posted by LimeWarp: No one has mentioned mind warping. Does anyone think anymindwarping was going on in this episode? Is it possible Tess hadanything to do with furthering the rift between the humans andaliens? I can think of several scenes in which the chararactersreactions seemed very off. I also thought the scene with Max inthe van trying to heal Alex was strange. It's hard to conjectureon something we really didn't see, but there seemed to besomething very off about that van scene. Interesting theories, etc. on the binary code.

Hi Limewarp!Since this SF framework includes "mindwarping" one always has to consider it a possibility. I agree that there are some very strange things afoot. The initial frames dealing with Alex and the delivery boy were bizarre.The dream scenes could, of course, be dreamwalking--but it would involve Alex (or a SS looking like Alex) as the one doing the walking. Moeover--it would also depend on how you see those dreams functioning. Positively, they help Izzy to bring closure to her relationship with Alex. Negatively, they cut her off from one of the relationships that might anchor her to earth.And you are right about Max--granted it is never nice to touch a corpse--there seemed to be something else going on there.If Mindwarping is operative in Cry Your Name--it would require (a?)power generator/s--more than Tess would be able to pull off.LSS

Posted 04-24-2001 11:25 AM
Rebecca
Addicted Fan Posts: 740 Registered: Dec 99
quote:

Originally posted by iluvm&m: [b]Plumeria Alex is not the only person to mention the cold. InThe Convention, when Valenti is talking to his dad about Hubble,Valenti Sr. says: "It's freezing in here. They're trying to killme." (courtesy Crashdown transcripts). Maybe there is more to thebeing cold than meets the eye.

[/B]

Can't remember which thread I read this on, but I think it was the SF of HOM, about Whittaker's journal stating that Earth is too close to it's sun, it's hot here for the skins. They prefer a colder climate? Of course, it's hot as hell in Arizona for humans too.[This message has been edited by Rebecca (edited 04-24-2001).]

Posted 04-24-2001 11:33 AM
LSS
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Posts: 1618 Registered: Feb 00
Hi folks!Responding to some off line e-mails...let me clearly say that I do not KNOW from spoiler information whether or not Alex is really dead. I really don't want to start any false rumors.What I said before is that if this was any SF novel that I was reading, there would be plenty of clues in Cry Your Name to make me doubt that Alex is truly dead. But "clues" may be red herrings and our writers have laid down tidbits never to pick them up again (or at least not yet). If this were a SF Novel I would say, for example, that the reason teachers, etc. saw such mood swings in Alex was either 1) something was bothering him to the extent that he could not function, or 2) that he was acting differently because he was different. In the realms of SF this "difference" could mean that 1) he was an Alex look-a-like (clone, android, shapeshifter, etc) or 2) that he was being manipulated (mindwarped, possessed, etc.). I thought it odd that this was a Ron Moore eppy, but with little SF. Perhaps the SF was more subtle? It is hard when one gets caught up in the storyline not to also remember that there are changes that happen because real life actors have other things to do in their life than act on Roswell. In spite of all the clues it could simply be that Hanks has other fish to fry and needs to be off Roswell. If that is the case, then I would say that Cry Your Name leaves plenty of loopholes big enough to bring him back.LSS

Posted 04-24-2001 12:41 PM
LSS
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Posts: 1618 Registered: Feb 00
BTW--nice pick up on the "frost/cold" connection. LSS

Posted 04-24-2001 01
:11 PM
Shimmer25
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Posts: 133 Registered: Feb 2001
Wow, this thread is really interesting...I like the "cold" references and binary code translations. I hope someone figures it out soon ------------------100% Candygirl :)

Posted 04-24-2001 01
:33 PM
LSS
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1618 Registered: Feb 00
quote:

Originally posted by dae: Binary codes cannot only symbolize letters, but numbers too.So, the binary code could be a longistude and latitude, which ismy little theory, and that poem is symbolic, saying that Liz isgoing to that place.But, this is only my theory, it could be seriously wrong.

Hi dae!If you translate the code into numbers--do the numbers make sense if they are referring to a geographical location? I am way out of my league here...I'm comfortable in the Humanities not the Hard Sciences!LSS

Posted 04-24-2001 01
:52 PM
Juniper
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Posts: 107 Registered: Oct 2000quote:

Originally posted by Qfanny: What does everything think about Max not being able to saveAlex???? I have my own ideas myself - I reject the FrankenAlextheory - but what do you think? [/B]

I just took it to mean that he was too far gone -- or too mangled physically -- or had been dead for too long for Max to have any healing effect. We always wondered if there were limits to his power, and he taxed himself in the past by performing the healings on the children. Are people suggesting Max could have healed Alex -- but didn't, for reasons only known to him or the podsters? Isabel gave a play-by-play of what she hoped was happening in the van (creepy; awesome work by Katie throughout the episode).Moments that further the alien/human rift: Michael reluctantly following M/T/I out of Alex's room after having just been as in denial about the possibility of Alex committing suicide. Was post-Sweeden Alex NOT our beloved bass-playing, blood-giving, blackjack-losing American Pie? It hadn't really occurred to me, but that was Mr. Juniper's theory from the start. Granted, Alex had seemed slightly suaver than usual since his return, but is that attributable to his being posessed (as a temp) or replaced with a shapeshifting double bent on killing him? Prom Alex seemed very much in character, especially his 'I don't want to fall for you again' routine. He seemed himself in the scene where Liz and Maria convince him not to see Isabel that night. But when the delivery boy shows up, he becomes a different person. Did the delivery boy say something that would trigger a post-hypnotic suggestion to go out and throw yourself in front of a truck? Something about 'cold food?'LSS, about Isabel's dreams. What's that about? We know Isabel's brain in dreams is as active and as in control as it is waking. Were her dreams veritable messages from beyond the grave, meant to satisfy the grieving audience by giving the two of them a chance to say their goodbyes, or were they manufactured visions from elsewhere? Or was it all just a dream and nothing more?Much as it seems obvious that "Alex" (whoever he was) did commit suicide, I do think Liz is on to something. What she's on to may well be a secret kept from the podsters as well. This mystery may be meant to keep the Royal Four from achieving ther mission, just as easily as it could be to help them succeed. Liz therefore may be half-right without knowing what she's talking about. (edited to acknowlege that yes, you did bring up the dreams and I missed it the first time)

[This message has been edited by Juniper (edited 04-24-2001).]

Posted 04-24-2001 03:06 PM
KatieK

Fan
Posts: 76 Registered: Apr 2001
Gender: F
The work everyone is doing on the binary code, that's amazing... I wonder how Shiri will pursue it...LSS- I agree with you. It would be impossible for Tess to windwarp not only Liz, Max, the driver of the other care, the entire police force, the coroner, and the *entire student body* of WRH. I don't think the dupes would have that power either. The "cold" references - maybe they were meant as foreshadowing to Alex's death, i.e. him being "cold"~Katie ------------------"Never give up on a miracle"

Posted 04-24-2001 03:10 PM
KatieK

Posted 04-24-2001 03:11 PM
KatieK

Posted 04-24-2001 04:11 PM
RemyS
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 246 Registered: Mar 00
*****Does anyone else think it odd that the only two people Max has failed to heal/save were Nacedo and now Alex? I am leaning to the theories expressed by others here that it was NOT Alex, at least not fully him. (possession? Kevar? shapeshifter? ???) Liz and Kyle both talk about Max "bringing them back", so I don't think being "dead" would be an issue for Max. Wasn't the father in ARCC dead? And Max felt bad that he hadn't saved him. (By choice) So isn't it possible that Max couldn't save Alex because he/it was some other life form. Just a thought....Steff/RemyS

Posted 04-24-2001 04:19 PM
dae
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 236 Registered: Feb 2001
Gender: F
LSS- Okay, lemme see if I can explain this. I believe so. That is, they would make sense. This is why. Because latitude and longitudes are only 2 numbers long each, my theory wouldn't make sense. But, if you want to find an exact spot, there are other numbers, sort of "mini" latitudes and longitudes that would point you to an exact spot. This is why the binary code could be pointing Liz in that direction. I hope I made things a bit clearer!------------------Maria:This is your only phone call isn't it?Micheal:YeahMaria: Awww,(hangs up)

Posted 04-24-2001 04:34 PM
thescoobygang

Ultimate Fan
Posts: 2050 Registered: Mar 00
Excellent start LSS. Ok, I am a bit rusty at the sci-fi analysis but I will take a stab at some "unspoiled" theorizing.BTW, I was under the impression that Alex's cold comment was still in reference to food not climate. To me, the way he said it didn't seem to indicate a physical aversion to cold but rather a complaint about the food always being cold. Doesn't make sense I know, but the whole thing is weird any way you look at it.onto the questions...1)The Us vs Them scenario definitely raises the dramatic intensity a notch. I doubt that the division will last since the group is obviously strongest when combining their human & alien talents---something the pod squad has been reluctant to admit to in the past. Of course the "death by association" accusation towards Max doesn't fly, but one can assume the source of Liz's anger is really grief and frustration over their dismissal of her concerns. I do find it interesting that all this seems to parallel the past again. In the past Villandra abandoned her brother over a man, in the midst of a civil war that threatened the balance of power. In the present, this act repeats itself on a much smaller scale where Isabel flees her brother once again(this time Alex not Khivar is the catalyst) while civil strife ensues as a result of Liz openly challenging Max's objectivity on the situation. 2)I agree with the suggestions that the binary code is either a set of co-ordinates or some activation code for the Granolith. So why did Liz recite the poetry at the precise moment she was looking at the code? It's difficult to say. The line can either apply to Alex---that he was indeed on some mission or journey when this happened. Or it can apply to Liz herself----that she has work to do before laying this to rest. In her own way she has "promises to keep" to Alex as well.3)The odd behaviour of Alex leading up to the accident seems to be a clear indicator that something is amiss. You can almost sense a strange duality coming from him. I am beginning to suspect that maybe Alex was being used as a receptacle for alien contact---much in the same way Brody is "possessed". On a subconscious level, cutting off the head of his own picture could be a way of saying that his body is here but his "head" is not(eg. his mind is not his own but that of someone else.) It is also highly suspicious that the photo was one taken in Sweden, suggesting the change may have taken place there. Also his complaint that he is sick of it(food)always being "cold" can be a tell-tale sign that this has become routine. If you recall in Wipe Out, Alex "awoke" to cold pancakes after returning from another plane of existence. The same situation would apply if Alex was like Brody---time would pass unnoticed and he would return to cold food. With this theory we can entertain the idea that maybe Alex crashed his car as a result of losing consciousness when the alien released the mind grip. Just a thought.

I also noticed that the last time we saw Alex he was drinking a Coke and looking at the photo in a picture frame. Later the photo(with no frame) ends up in the car missing a piece. When Liz goes to his room in the episode we can see the Coke can still sitting there because according to his father the room remain untouched. I would say that the Coke can, picture frame, book and concert tickets suggest that Alex abruptly got up in the middle of something and just walked away. Why?Scooby

[This message has been edited by thescoobygang (edited 04-24-2001).]

Posted 04-24-2001 04:59 PM
agcovell

Fan
Posts: 51 Registered: Jun 00
I agree that clearly something was up with Alex. I don't believe he committed suicide -- at least not intentionally. What I'm not sure of is why he wrote the binary code on the credit card slip. Did something that someone said or did (like the fact that the food was cold) trigger a malfunction in some sort of programming? It almost looked like an error code that a computer might give you if you'd made a certain kind of mistake. (Just a stab in the dark, people. I don't know much about computer languages).

Posted 04-24-2001 06:05 PM
Juniper
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 107 Registered: Oct 2000 I have promises to keepAnd miles to go before I sleep...Miles back to Antar?

Posted 04-24-2001 06:21 PM
Juniper
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 107 Registered: Oct 2000 I have promises to keepAnd miles to go before I sleep...Miles back to Antar?

Posted 04-24-2001 07:03 PM
LSS
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1618 Registered: Feb 00
quote:

Originally posted by thescoobygang: ....So why did Liz recite the poetry at the precise moment she waslooking at the code? It's difficult to say. The line can eitherapply to Alex---that he was indeed on some mission or journey whenthis happened. Or it can apply to Liz herself----that she has workto do before laying this to rest. In her own way she has "promisesto keep" to Alex as well.

Hi Scooby!I agree that the line is interesting--I mean, of all the poetry written...why that line?The line itself has two main ideas: 1) promises to keep, and 2) miles to go before I sleep. As I was thinking of these I realized that there might be a plain meaning of the line (Alex's death) as well as a symbolic meaning (to the broader storyline).1) "Miles to go" = her investigation of Alex's death and the lengths she will go to find why he died? OR?/AND? A reference to a another trip...off earth?

2) "before I sleep" = before she can rest? Or before she takes that final sleep (death).3) "promises to keep" = to Alex in the name of friendship OR/AND some other promise we have yet to know but one that deals with Max/Liz's ultimate Destiny? ...if you are into the Liz & alien mythology approach you may see in that line something far more than simply avenging Alex's memory.LSS

Posted 04-24-2001 07:13 PM
Qfanny
Crazed Fan
Posts: 1299 Registered: Jul 00
Excellent points made about the binary coding and Frost. I don't really have much to add. I definately agree with the humans side of US v THEM. I do think Alex was murdered as Liz suggests. ------------------From NebraskaQfanny/MOB14Liz is not an alienApril 28th Kansas City Gathering

Posted 04-24-2001 09:06 PM
LimeWarp
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 403 Registered: Mar 00
Thanks for the welcome LSS. I don't post a whole lot but I always come to the sci-fi thread and read every post. The threads are always great. Many interesting theories and ideas, etc.I don't think Tess was mind warping everyone at one time. I agree that it would have been too much for just Tess to have been doing. I do wonder if Tess was mindwarping at various times throughout the episode. Specifically Max in certain instances.thescoobygang - I like your theory on Alex. I think your theory is entirely possible. It would certainly explain alot. ------------------"If things go really well, maybe we'll upgrade to #3 pencils." Ed to Shirley

Posted 04-24-2001 09:55 PM
Lameduck
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 200 Registered: May 00
In regards to the possesed Alex theory, I keep thinking of what he says when first back from Sweden. "Sometimes I look in a mirror and I don't recognize myself."

In regards to mindwarping in this episode, I think Tess was doing some in the van scene. I'll have to rewatch it (I haven't had the heart to sit through it again, yet) but while Isabel is giving her description of what should be happening, Tess's expression struck me as odd. The expressions on the rest of the group were somber and expectant, but Tess's seemed different. At first I thought she was about to break down crying, but I can't think of any connection between the two. Then I remembered how earlier when she used her power, she'd scrunch her face up. And I thought maybe she was using her power, but trying not to be obvious about it.

Finally, and this isn't SF related, but didn't anyone find it odd that Sean was out of town. If anyone is possesed by Kivar, my money's on Sean. He always seems fixated on Max. If Liz is more important than anyone realizes, then one of her roles is as support for Max, and Sean is the one trying the most to pull Liz away from Max.

Posted 04-24-2001 10:36 PM
Granolith
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 324 Registered: Oct 2000 Gender: F
You guys are coming up with great thoughts. The cold references could be references to Alex's death. Good thought.I do think Alex could have been possessed off and on since Sweden. So. Do we think he was possessed when he said that stuff about life being a lie and signed the receipt? Or was he himself at that point, but realized something was happening to him?I think when Liz saw the code/signature she said that line of the poem refering to herself. Now she has more proof and she will not stop until she finds the truth. Go Liz!How would Alex know a code for the Granolith or why would an evil alien leave a clue like that for Liz to find? If it was not an evil alien why would it cause Alex to be killed?Now I have to go watch for the alien pic someone said used to have peace signs but now has guns. That sounds creepy.

Posted 04-25-2001 01
:25 AM
Hoku
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 278 Registered: May 00
Gender: F
Just a couple of observations:1. Alex's reaction to the cold food delivered wasn't an extreme reaction of someone who was depressed or suicidal. His reaction reminded me of Grant's possession when Grant was talking to Isabel in the car after kidnapping her. It was like he was coming out of a fog and making no sense because he wasn't in control.2. The disfigurement of the photograph shone no clues for me. Sorry I know Liz read into the decapitation but I just thought Alex was cutting himself out of his old Swedish girlfriend's life because he's moving forward with Isabel. I guess because the picutre was more purposely cut rather than torn it lead Liz to believe that something wasn't right which I guess looking at it...nah, it still doesn't give me any clues.3. Max not being able to heal Alex basically put to rest the idea that Max can play God. He can't! 4. Humans vs Aliens, it was bound to happen. Liz has always been the human leader while Max the alien. Now we will see how well one works without the other and if they can each (human and alien) succeed on Earth on their own. My guess is that both will fail without the others help.Well that's my thoughts on this episode. Good night!

Posted 04-25-2001 06:13 AM
LSS
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1618 Registered: Feb 00
quote:

Originally posted by Hoku: Just a couple of observations: 1. Alex's reaction to the cold food delivered wasn't an extremereaction of someone who was depressed or suicidal. His reactionreminded me of Grant's possession when Grant was talking to Isabelin the car after kidnapping her. It was like he was coming out ofa fog and making no sense because he wasn't in control.

Hi Hoku!I agree that there was something extremely bizarre about that scene. Cold food--however unpleasant--should not evoke that reaction! LSS

Posted 04-25-2001 06:50 AM
plumeria

Fan Forum's Finest
Posts: 4235 Registered: May 00
quote:

Originally posted by Hoku: 2. The disfigurement of the photograph shone no clues for me.Sorry I know Liz read into the decapitation but I just thoughtAlex was cutting himself out of his old Swedish girlfriend's lifebecause he's moving forward with Isabel.

But I think then that he would have cut *Lianna* out of the picture, not himself, if that were the case. No, I think the cut picture is a clue, but I don't know what.I agree with people who think that Alex was possessed, ala Brody/Larek or Grant/queen. I had bought into the "changed" Alex from Sweden, but this Alex we saw in CYN was different in his mood swings.I have to wonder (and this is pure, unspoiled conjecture) if Alex is really dead at all -- what if the real Alex has been hijacked off somewhere else (by his possession?) and a shapeshifter is the one who died, to make it *look* like Alex died. I know, it's a stretch. But I just wonder...Re: the binary code having something to do with the Granolith... did Alex know about the Granolith? And if he was being possessed by another alien -- how did *they* know about the Granolith? (i.e. none of the Skins knew where it was)Has it ever been mentioned *where* the accident took place? Is there a way of discerning where Alex was headed when the accident happened? Also, I don't know if this is a blooper or significant, but when the food delivery guy arrived, it was daylight. When Valenti came across the wreck, it was dark. It seems like Alex moved very abruptly, having left his soda on the desk and all -- but what if it indicates he was off doing something else (under possession?) for quite a while before the accident actually happened? Or is it just a filming boo boo?Ok, I really have to get to work now. I hope some of my blather made sense.------------------Plu's FicChemical emotion, falsely real... (IP)[This message has been edited by plumeria (edited 04-25-2001).]

Posted 04-25-2001 08:46 AM
LimeWarp
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 403 Registered: Mar 00
Plumeria - I think you could be onto something with the lapse in time if it wasn't a filming error.------------------"If things go really well, maybe we'll upgrade to #3 pencils." Ed to Shirley

Posted 04-25-2001 01
:37 PM
Hoku
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 278 Registered: May 00
Gender: F
quote:

Has it ever been mentioned *where* the accident took place? Isthere a way of discerning where Alex was headed when the accidenthappened? Also, I don't know if this is a blooper or significant,but when the food delivery guy arrived, it was daylight. WhenValenti came across the wreck, it was dark. It seems like Alexmoved very abruptly, having left his soda on the desk and all --but what if it indicates he was off doing something else (underpossession?) for quite a while before the accident actuallyhappened? Or is it just a filming boo boo? [/B]

Plumeria I think you are on to somehting. The change in time from Daylight to Night escaped me at first until you mentioned it. That is a BIG CHAD. What was Alex doing from the time L/M left him with the delivery boy to the time of the crash at night. Now Isabel did say to Alex that she would be at the CD that night so the cut to the night sequence was probably done to speed things up but it leaves us with a HANGING CHAD on the events prior. I think, like all TV series, that due to the limited time the writers have to tell a story they have to move quickly from day to night and in doing so leave out information. Hopefully there might be some sort of a flash sequence later on down the line in Departure to fill us all in on what the heck was Alex's movements during that missing time period which lead to his death. I don't know if I mentioned this earlier but does anyone think that Isabel Dreams of Alex was actually Isabel talking to Dead Alex? I know she can dreamwalk and she can receive images from people who are in need of help (Laurie Dupree/Tess) so I was just wondering if another of her powers could be talking to the dead on the other side...sort of like John Edwards. If this was a new power it would allow for the writers to bring Alex back to talk to Isabel and maybe even help out the gang in times of danger or need, like a guardian. Of course, this is me being hopefully not to lose Alex Whitman character cause I think Colin Hanks has such potential and is cute

Posted 04-25-2001 02:03 PM
Barrybud
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 465 Registered: Apr 00
Gender:M
quote:

------------------BarryIt must have been a mind warp! Get a new excuse!Aplscr BBB Catfightr Hussy OTO H-MOB

Posted 04-25-2001 02:11 PM
Luna G
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 132 Registered: Nov 2000quote:

Originally posted by Hoku: I don't know if I mentioned this earlier but does anyone thinkthat Isabel Dreams of Alex was actually Isabel talking to DeadAlex? I know she can dreamwalk and she can receive images frompeople who are in need of help (Laurie Dupree/Tess) so I was justwondering if another of her powers could be talking to the dead onthe other side...sort of like John Edwards. If this was a newpower it would allow for the writers to bring Alex back to talk toIsabel and maybe even help out the gang in times of danger orneed, like a guardian.

This wouldn't even be a new power if you remember the ghost from ARCC that haunted Max. Put me down on record as convinced that Alex's appearance in Isabel's dreams was not a natural, subconscious element, but something alien-related. Alex himself, another alien impersonating him? Now, here's a question. Let's assume for a moment that Alex is really dead, and that his essence (to use a good Roswellian word) is communicating with Isabel from beyond the grave. Where does this essence reside? And, if Isabel can communicate with Alex's essence, or vice versa, what does that say about death in the Roswell universe? Not so permanent, huh? If the podsters were created from not only human DNA mixed with alien DNA, but also from the essences of the original royal four, then the aliens must have the power to not only communicate with, but capture these essences from wherever they would otherwise reside.In the promo, Tess says she'll be there for all eternity (paraphrase). In this context, maybe it isn't just a figure of speech.

------------------LunaYou've got to have a plan. Unless it is the Destiny Plan.

Posted 04-25-2001 02:15 PM
treefrogie84
Fan in Training
Posts: 4 Registered: Apr 2001
Gender: F
okay, three things1) Hi, I'm Treefrogie. I'm way to obsessed with this show for my own good.2) I spent the entire day working on the whole binary thing. First I tried Morse code- made no sense what so ever. No matter how you split it up, you ended up with gibberish. But I was sitting in math class and I looked down and saw my copy of Uylesses (I told you, I'm obsessed!). What if the numbers were like page number line number? Using Uylesses it makes no sense but it might using the EXACT copy of the Frost poems Alex had. I pretty much picked a division out of the blue (4- four letters in lies and cold) but then you get: 1110 01
00 1001 1101 1001 or using logical splits in that... pg 11, line 10; pg 1,ln 0(title maybe?); pg 10 ln 1; pg 11 lne 1; pg 10, ln 1; I don't know maybe I'm completely off my rocker here. BTW- graphing calculators can't handle that large of a number...3) Personally I don't think Alex is dead. But that may be my optimism (hey, I don't think Chewie is dead either!) shining through. Even if he is, mindwarping is a possiblity. Some one has already thrown this idea out in a story (only then it was liz...), but it takes like 2 min. to mindrape/inattention someone to not see the car or the line, thus running head long into a semi.I don't know, I'm just a really really upset stargazer!SAndy------------------Stargazer*Dreamer*Candygirl*RAGE #50

Posted 04-25-2001 03:18 PM
Juniper
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 107 Registered: Oct 2000 If you haven't already, the SciFi bunch should check out the thread about the Mystery Behind Alex's Death, specifically a post on page three by "totenhosen" suggesting that the delivery boy may have been abducted and/or the food tampered with. I highly recommend y'all take a look.

Posted 04-25-2001 03:32 PM
brainchick
Fan in Training
Posts: 37 Registered: Apr 2001
Gender: F
I've only gotten to read part of the thread so sorry if I'm repeating an earlier theory. What if the 1's and 0's are more simple than binary code? Hope I'm not showing my age or lack of familiarity with current technology too much, but what if the 1's and 0's are analogous to settings of toggles switches seen on older computer equipment? Specifically I'm thinking they could be the proper settings for the granolith to make it a transportation device. Then this would tie into the promo where Max says "We can go home now". Thoughts anybody?------------------It was you.Always Dreamin'

Posted 04-25-2001 04:58 PM
TVPooh
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 101 Registered: Nov 2000 I also don't think Alex is really dead. I think the dreams were Isabel communicating with Alex in another dimension. I definately think his death or faked death was alien related. About the code-It's definately a clue to something. HAs anyone tried the English theory? I was an English major but I don't know much about poetry. Could it be part of a code? What would happen if someone placed the siganture code over something else?

Posted 04-25-2001 05:24 PM
Qfanny
Crazed Fan
Posts: 1299 Registered: Jul 00
Juniper, thanks very much for the heads up on the "Mystery of Alex's Death" thread. I will have to check it out.Someone asked about the change from Day to Night and the possiblity of a huge Chad. Well, as a witness to the crash shooting, I can answer some questions. First, if you watch the setting, you can tell that Alex is in a very rural location. There are no street lights. (Trust me, I was there.) Although the production chose this locale for various reason, in the context of the entire Roswell canon, I would assume that Alex did some thinking and driving before going over to Isabels. Alex seemed depressed but not suicidial. Maybe he needed to go to the country and just think about Isabel and if really wanted to return to his pre Sweden ways.Now the picture: I have problems with it. 1) Could be possible suicide clue, true, but I doubt it. None of the main characters could think of Alex as committing suicide. Max had to be persuaded by Valenti's file to even consider it. So, I'm ruling suicide out.2) How on Earth would a picture like that be missed? I mean, wouldn't the car first be sent to a crime lab to be washed out and studied to find the cause of the "accident?" How that picture got left in the vehicle and not collected by our team of Hansen and Valenti is a mystery.3) There could have been a number of reasons for Alex to suddenly vear into the truck. A wandering horse is one reason to swerve as we know from BB. The fact is, that everything looks like a set up and a huge cover story. Conclusion:Is Valenti/Hansen involved with this coverup? The car was not sent to a crime lab or studied. The picture would have turned up whether Liz found it or not. If it was in Valenti's possession, the gang would have known about it. So what would be the purpose of someone deliberately leaving that photo in a wrecked car? Perhaps to drive Liz on a wild goose chase? To tell the gang that there is something more going on? I don't know. I should go over to that thread Juniper started.Now, here's something completely different.Last night I watched Nova. The program was about transgenetic species, or hybrids. I found it interesting that the scientists were saying that even you if take a gene from a fish and put it with a strawberry, you still get a strawberry (in this case.) Which leds me to ask you all, if you take the essense from an alien, and put it with a human, do you still have a human. Just because the pod squad look like humans, should they be considered humans in actuality. They sure don't look like aliens to me.------------------From NebraskaQfanny/MOB14Liz is not an alienApril 28th Kansas City Gathering

Posted 04-25-2001 08:01 PM
plumeria

Fan Forum's Finest
Posts: 4235 Registered: May 00
quote:

Originally posted by Qfanny: Last night I watched Nova. The program was about transgeneticspecies, or hybrids. I found it interesting that the scientistswere saying that even you if take a gene from a fish and put itwith a strawberry, you still get a strawberry (in this case.)Which leds me to ask you all, if you take the essense from analien, and put it with a human, do you still have a human. Justbecause the pod squad look like humans, should they be consideredhumans in actuality. They sure don't look like aliens to me.

Interesting. Hmmm... Some points to ponder in regards to this issue.

1. Nacedo said that the Podsters are basically just advanced humans.2. The So47 aliens looked *very* different from humans. As did the aliens in Gpa Dupree's sketches.3. Momogram said she was taking that particular form because it "would be familiar", thus implying that her normal form is very different -- alien. This would imply to me that the Podsters actually *are* humans -- except for their blood, I guess...The thing is, in that fish-strawberry example you gave, you're taking things that are *vastly* different -- plant and animal. Not the same chromosome count or genetic structure or remotely similar internal form (i.e. seeds and fiber vs. heart, lungs, digestive tract, brain, etc). Humans and these aliens are likely to be much closer, I'm betting as close as humans and some of the non-human apes anyway. So do the same "override" rules of hybridization that you saw on Nova still apply when the bases are more closely related?

------------------Plu's FicChemical emotion, falsely real... (IP)

Posted 04-25-2001 08:52 PM
LSS
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1618 Registered: Feb 00
Hi treefrogie84!Your first post? We are honored! Welcome to the SF of [Episode] threads! LSS

Posted 04-25-2001 09:16 PM
LSS
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1618 Registered: Feb 00
quote:

Hi Qfanny!I did not watch the show, but I do have some observations:1) we do not know what consitutes the "essence" that was used to fashion the hybrids or how much of it was used. Qfanny--in the program exactly what was mixed? Was a single fish cell added to a whole strawberry? If so then one could also assume that if one added a single strawberry cell to a fish you'd still have a fish. That is, QUANTITY might have something to do with what the result is labeled.2) how advanced does an "advanced human" have to be before it becomes something else? Presumably Max and Co are still human because the x-rays have not turned up anything unusual structurally. And Max's organs are human. But his brain development is not "earth standard (at least 21st c. standard)" and his blood is purely alien.SF has played with the notion of what consitutes a "human being." How many body parts can you alter and still be human? We are all willing to accept Max because his outward form correlates to our own. In reality he might just as logically be called "human+" -- when you think of it, it is kind of strange that Max & Co refer to themselves as aliens rather than humans when the majority of their bodies parts are, in fact, human. A lot of writers suggest that as long as the brain/cognitive center is human, then the outward form does not change the fact that the being is human (Robocop addresses this issue). But a human body with an alien brain is often NOT thought of as human no matter how "human" it looks. We have been told that Max's brain is simply "advanced human" but season two has pushed the credibility of that statement. And if Max is truly "remembering" then something in that brain is more than human.LSS

Posted 04-25-2001 09:59 PM
Qfanny
Crazed Fan
Posts: 1299 Registered: Jul 00
Well, the were actually several examples of transgenetic species but I chose the fish/strawberry one because I wanted to get across the point that the genes were spliced from two DIFFERENT species. The program was more or less about genetically modified foods. For example, we had a discussion about the DeKalb hat that Father Whitaker wore and how much money seed companies spend on the creation of hybrid seeds over on Rosta's thread last fall. Putting aside the ethics of the debate, which are rich in themselves, the science of genetically modified foods suggests that even if you take a gene from an apple and splice into a carrot the bulk of the transgenetic species is that it's a carrot. When you look at this carrot chemically, it's still a carrot, same proteins.A real life example would be a rice that has been genetically modified with genes from daffidils (sp?). This rice is still rice chemicially, but the daffidil genes had vitamin A into a staple. The rice was designed to help prevent blindness in third world countries. There was also examples of plants being modified with genes from different species so the plant would produce it's own insecticide....Again, ethics aside - the theories of many of the scientists was basically, "if it walks, talks, and looks like a duck, it's a duck."I wonder if this assumption would fit our Pod Squad. If we keep the question in the context of Cry Your Name, I think that Max's reaction (crying, upset) and everyone else's reaction was very human. They look like humans, they talk like humans, but are they humans??? Or or they aliens. I am afraid to say it, but it seems that the scales tip to the Earthling side more the Podians. But that's just my assessment.------------------From NebraskaQfanny/MOB14Liz is not an alienApril 28th Kansas City Gathering

Posted 04-25-2001 11:53 PM
shapeshifter
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1802 Registered: May 2000 So if Alex has 'gone away' like Liz broke up with Max so that the aliens could be just with aliens, how then will they resolve that post-So47, post-Hybrid Chronicles Michael is very attached to his humanity.

Posted 04-26-2001 03:58 AM
AlexEvans
Fan Forum Senior
Posts: 2698 Registered: Oct 2000 Normally I just lurk on these threads, but the theories are too intriguing. They've got me thinking.===I think Alex acted too much like himself to be a shapeshifter, or a look-alike Skin. But perhaps he was (intermittently) possessed.When did he first suspect? Is that why he was afraid to get involved with Isabel? Is that why he only went to the prom with her after learning she was leaving Roswell next year? I think it is likely he started to suspect soon after Sweden, which must be when it was done.Imagine his terror. But saying anything might be fatal not only to him but to whoever he told, if someone was looking through his eyes even when he was in control of his own body. So he had to find a subtle way to get word out. Leave clues. Say he wasn't the same person he had been.Once he was sure suicide was an option. That way he couldn't be used anymore. Couldn't be used to hurt Izzy. Of course, Kivar would just possess someone else. Alex couldn't just abandon her, and all his friends. He had promises to keep.But what happens if a possessee dies with the possessor in his head?

Maybe Alex did turn the steering wheel, as he felt Kivar enter him, hoping to kill them both. I can't imagine Alex committing suicide for any other reason.Theory 2: Kivar realized Alex knew he was possessed. Knew Alex was leaving clues. So he had Alex murdered before Alex escaped his control.

------------------Adopt an Isabel Clone

Posted 04-26-2001 05:24 AM
plumeria

Fan Forum's Finest
Posts: 4235 Registered: May 00
quote:

Originally posted by AlexEvans: Maybe Alex did turn the steering wheel, as he felt Kivar enterhim, hoping to kill them both. I can't imagine Alex committingsuicide for any other reason. Theory 2: Kivar realized Alex knew he was possessed. Knew Alex wasleaving clues. So he had Alex murdered before Alex escaped hiscontrol.

I think these both have real merit.------------------Plu's FicChemical emotion, falsely real... (IP)

Posted 04-26-2001 05:53 AM
PepperjackCandy
Addicted Fan
Posts: 682 Registered: Dec 2000quote:

Originally posted by thescoobygang: Also his complaint that he is sick of it(food)always being "cold"can be a tell-tale sign that this has become routine. If yourecall in Wipe Out, Alex "awoke" to cold pancakes after returningfrom another plane of existence. The same situation would apply ifAlex was like Brody---time would pass unnoticed and he wouldreturn to cold food. With this theory we can entertain the ideathat maybe Alex crashed his car as a result of losingconsciousness when the alien released the mind grip. Just athought.

I like your "cold food" theory, scooby!Though I'm wondering if it's not K'Var that's been possessing Alex. Perhaps he took over Alex with a view towards getting one of the Podsters to give up the location of the Granolith?I've got this whole complicated K'Var/Vilandra/Alex/Isabel romance in my head, but I'm not sure how it'll come across.For example, in HOM, Alex says that he doesn't want to fall in love with Isabel again, which is certainly true of Alex, but also could be true of K'Var's feelings for Vilandra.I guess what it comes down to is that first, K'Var considered Alex a means to an end. Then, he identified with Alex (the "I don't want to fall in love with you again" line). And finally, he viewed Alex as a rival, and, probably on an impulse, possessed Alex, forcing him to drive too fast and pull into the path of the oncoming truck.I posted this thought over on the CHADs thread as well, but the binary number 11100100100111011001 translates into 936,409.If you take that as map coordinates, you get 93 degrees+ longitude and 40 degrees+ latitude, which is near the town of Cora, Missouri, Lat: 40 06 N Long: 093 07 Whttp://www.getty.edu/research/tools/vocabulary/tgn/index.html I don't know why they'd choose Cora, Missouri, specifically, but at least it's reachable from Roswell, if the "miles to go" in the poem refers to traveling to those coordinates.------------------Boarderlander * CHADDif it isn't complicated, he probably isn't a soul mate

Posted 04-26-2001 07:05 AM
LSS
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1618 Registered: Feb 00
quote:

Originally posted by PepperjackCandy: Though I'm wondering if it's not K'Var that's been possessingAlex....I've got this whole complicated K'Var/Vilandra/Alex/Isabelromance in my head, but I'm not sure how it'll come across. For example, in HOM, Alex says that he doesn't want to fall inlove with Isabel again, which is certainly true of Alex, but alsocould be true of K'Var's feelings for Vilandra. I guess what it comes down to is that first, K'Var considered Alexa means to an end. Then, he identified with Alex (the "I don'twant to fall in love with you again" line). And finally, he viewedAlex as a rival, and, probably on an impulse, possessed Alex,forcing him to drive too fast and pull into the path of theoncoming truck.

Hi Pepperjackcandy!That is a fascinating theory (Alex/K'var). I don't know if the writers' are going there, but if not it would have been a great SF/Romance twist! And it nicely brings together several story elements...gosh, maybe YOU should going into writing!!!As for the coordinates--isn't the Granolith in the pod cave (behind the torn pods)? So if your coordinates are right, it can't be the Granolith (unless it has moved/been moved). You know, we have so concentrated on WHAT the binary code means that we haven't really addressed thoroughly the issue of WHY it was left on the credit card form. I mean, it only was happenchance that the delivery boy showed it to Liz. Normally, one might simply have thrown the thing away. Or perhaps Alex thought it would have been brought back to him or his family in an attempt to clear the debt? There are easier ways of leaving messages than that!LSS

Posted 04-26-2001 07:18 AM
RemyS
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 246 Registered: Mar 00
***** I've been reading this thread from the beginning, and am intrigued by the code at the end of the Visa receipt. I sent it out to two "mathmatician" friends of mine. One of them responded (he is a bar code systems expert) and he says in the decimal values of the binary code it is the following: 1110 01
00 1001 1101 1001 14----4----9----13----9 If this has already been determined, sorry. I don't have a clue yet as to what it could mean. And I'm still waiting for a reply from the other friend. Will let you know if she comes up with something different.Steff/RemyS[This message has been edited by RemyS (edited 04-26-2001).][This message has been edited by RemyS (edited 04-26-2001).]

Posted 04-26-2001 09:44 AM
Luna G
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 132 Registered: Nov 2000 About the idea that Alex was possessed-In the photograph, it seemed to me that his head was cut off. Ever hear of the expression "if your hand causes you to sin, cut it off"?Maybe he cut the photo as he realized that he was possessed, to symbolically remove the source of the problem. I wonder if the other piece of that photograph will turn up anywhere in the next few episodes.

Posted 04-26-2001 09:53 AM
Luna G
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 132 Registered: Nov 2000quote:

Originally posted by LSS: You know, we have so concentrated on WHAT the binary code meansthat we haven't really addressed thoroughly the issue of WHY itwas left on the credit card form. I mean, it only was happenchancethat the delivery boy showed it to Liz. Normally, one might simplyhave thrown the thing away. Or perhaps Alex thought it would havebeen brought back to him or his family in an attempt to clear thedebt? There are easier ways of leaving messages than that! LSS

I agree that this seems like a strange and unreliable way to leave a message. If it was returned to his parents, who don't know about any alien stuff, they wouldn't know it was significant. What are the odds that Liz or even Valenti would ever see the receipt? When he wrote it down, he wasn't even concentrating, and even a die-hard computer code person might have trouble remembering a sequence of twenty 1's and 0's. I think this number was written almost unconsciously by the "Alex" speaking to the delivery person. If both identities were present in Alex's mind, and co-existing, then could the 1's and 0's be a message from the identity who was being supressed (i.e., not in charge of the body at the time.)OK, I'm having trouble explaining myself today.------------------LunaYou've got to have a plan. Unless it is the Destiny Plan.

Posted 04-26-2001 10:57 AM
LSS
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1618 Registered: Feb 00
Hi Luna!"You've got to have a plan. Unless it is the Destiny Plan." Cute--I hadn't noticed that statement at the end of your message.Isn't it strange that "Destiny" (as a plan) has played such a small part (if any) in Season Two (as of yet anyway)? With all the aliens walking around on earth and all the memories we are seeing recovered, can't someone get that book and decipher it? Sigh...it is hard when logic runs into the wall of silence created by our writers!(Talk about a writer's "block"!!!!)LSS

Posted 04-26-2001 11:23 AM
Juniper
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 107 Registered: Oct 2000quote:

Originally posted by PepperjackCandy: For example, in HOM, Alex says that he doesn't want to fall inlove with Isabel again, which is certainly true of Alex, but alsocould be true of K'Var's feelings for Vilandra. [/B]

It could be, but it has not ever been established that K'var and Vilandra shared a great love. Though Vilandra is said to have betrayed her people for him, there's still the very real possibility that K'var only pursued her for political/personal gain. There's also stillthe possibility that Vilandra was frced or coerced into betrayal, or did so unintentionally (like was mindraped and gave away strategic information).

Posted 04-26-2001 01
:56 PM
Luna G
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 132 Registered: Nov 2000 I also like Pepperjack Candy's Alex/Kivar/Isabel/Vilandra idea. Even if Nicholas et al have been lying to Isabel about her betrayal, the most effective deceptions are the ones which contain an element of truth. In this case, I think (particularly when you observe Isabel's weakness for strange men-Alex excluded, of course ) Vilandra really did have romantic feelings for Kivar.Alex's statement at the prom when told Isabel to stop being so charming seemed so weird. Not the "stop being so charming", but his response to her "I'm serious". It seemed almost vicious. The sort of reaction a once-spurned lover would give to his ex?LSS, I'm glad you like my sig. It used to just be You've got to have a plan. (Said by Liz in Monsters) But I've got this feeling that the Destiny Plan will be ressurected soon. A product of higher intelligence? Hmm. Let's reincarnate the ruling family as another species? Let's send them with protectors that don't even bother to be present for the hatching? Let's give them a reference book with pretty pictures that they can't read? Oh, yes, and my personal favorite: Let's send two sets so that there can be a really spectacular civil war when Zan #2 and Zan #3 go head to head. It's a silly plan. That's why I'm truly hoping that some portion of the Mom-o-gram was a mindwarp.Oh, and I've left the binary code translation to others as it is not my strong point, but here's a thought. What if it is a code for another language altogether? Swedish? Alien hieroglyphics? Just a thought.------------------LunaYou've got to have a plan. Unless it is the Destiny Plan.

Posted 04-26-2001 03:45 PM
treefrogie84
Fan in Training
Posts: 4 Registered: Apr 2001
Gender: F
quote:

Originally posted by Luna G: Maybe he cut the photo as he realized that he was possessed, tosymbolically remove the source of the problem. [/B]

even if it doesn't, isn't doing something like that [cutting the photo] seem awfully like vodooish to you? Like maybe it wasn't OUR Alex (as in pre-sweden) who cut it. Maybe it was who/what ever was posessing him doing the cutting, trying to rid itself of that aspect of the host body. Because really, wouldn't it be simplier to posess someone if their mind wasn't fighting you? So you cut out the person, but try to leave the knowledge of the personality intact. But what if THEY (being k'var, nickolas, darth vader, emperor palintine whoever) messed up, only cut out part of Alex. And the part that was left was fighting with all it's might to survive or failing that to save his friends. Unfortunaltly, the only way to do that in this case, was to kill both the possessor and the posessie.(is that even a word?) Therefore, IF Alex is dead, and this is not just some big scam by she-who's-name-shall-not-pass-through-my-keyboard, then it was most likly to kill off a major, but subtle, threat to the group.Or that's my theroy anyway.Treefrogienote: I don't know much about vodoo or any thing like that, so if my take is compleatly out of line, I appologize and ask that you e-mail me and tell me.Thanks------------------Stargazer*Dreamer*Candygirl*RAGE #50

[This message has been edited by treefrogie84 (edited 04-26-2001).]

Posted 04-26-2001 04:55 PM
ClaireBehr
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 229 Registered: Jul 00
When you take the numbers you guys found, 14-4-9-13-9 and line them up with the alphabet (ex. 1=a, 2=b, 3=c ect.) You get the letters: N-D-I-M-II don't know if that means anything but, it's worth a try.-Claire------------------The woods are lovely dark and deep.But I have promises to keep.And miles to go before I sleep.

Posted 04-26-2001 04:58 PM
ClaireBehr
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 229 Registered: Jul 00
Sorry, double post.-Claire------------------The woods are lovely dark and deep.But I have promises to keep.And miles to go before I sleep.[This message has been edited by ClaireBehr (edited 04-26-2001).]

Posted 04-26-2001 05:19 PM
AlexEvans
Fan Forum Senior
Posts: 2698 Registered: Oct 2000 Just a thought... has anyone looked at Alex's computer? Could be something there. Particularly if Alex can write code in binary, so if Kivar is looking through his eyes he can't tell what Alex is up to, he may have left a message.Maybe the numbers - or what can be derived from them - is a password. If they do point to a line in the poem, as Liz apparently believes, maybe that line isn't only a clue, but gives access to more.

------------------Adopt an Isabel Clone

Posted 04-26-2001 06:03 PM
LateRoswellian

Fan Forum's Finest
Posts: 4496 Registered: Mar 2000 Gender:M
Hi...love all these theories

one I didn't see mentioned...Liz is seeing not just numbers..but a sample of Alex's handwriting......if she knows it like I think she would...she may have immediately recognized that it WASN'T Alex's handwriting.Having taken some numerical control in school many years ago...I dusted off my text book. Straight binary code is normally read right to left. and using the powers of 2 to determine an final number....farthest right is 2 to the power of 0 which equals 1and so forth across...this number is 20 digits in length so it goes up to 2 raised to the 20th power on the far left side.

binary code is read right to left or vertically here bottom to top. This may not line up properly when I submit it..1 = 2 pwr20 = 10485761 = 2 pwr19 = 5242881 = 2 pwr18 = 262144001 = 2 pwr15 = 32768001 = 2 pwr12 = 4096001 = 2 pwr9 = 5121 = 2 pwr8 = 2561 = 2 pwr7 = 12801 = 2 pwr5 = 321 = 2 pwr4 = 16001 = 2 pwr0 = 1--------1,872,817just more questions than answers is all I still come up with.------------------theme song..Here With Who???... UBI JUVEYS need NOT apply!!! LateR, Gary

Posted 04-26-2001 06:09 PM
alien_lover
Crazed Fan
Posts: 1151 Registered: May 00
I have been thinking about the code thing a lot and since the translation of it makes no sense maybe it was like something else.They mentioned The Matrix in this episode. Well for those who have seen it know that the Matrix is in code. When you look at the Matrix all you see are 1's and 0's.Also they looked at it to tell them what was going on in the Matrix (so they could watch people in the Matrix.) So what I was thinking is maybe the code isn't a binary code at all. Maybe Alex was writing down a warning... when you heard Alex talking about how everything was wrong it seemed like he was trying to convince the deliever guy he was suicidal. Or maybe that wasn't the real Alex at all. Maybe the real Alex wrote down some kind of code on the recipt. A cry for help.There are 20 numbers right... well maybe instead of it meaning 20 numbers it stands for 20 letters. The only one I could think of was Khivar-is-Possession is 20 letters with spaces which is the only one that seemed significant (thought it's not very good English.)The question is how would Alex have known the deliever guy would deliever the recipt to Liz. Did he know Liz would question his death (the scientist in her) or was it wishful thinking.This might be totally far fetched but it just seemed plausible. It could also have been put like a computer program thing cuz that's what Alex was something being used to store information and being controlled. If this possesssion theory is right.alien ------------------I have promises to keep and miles to go before I sleep... ~Liz[This message has been edited by alien_lover (edited 04-26-2001).]

Posted 04-26-2001 06:44 PM
Reggie
Addicted Fan
Posts: 745 Registered: Jul 00
quote:

Originally posted by Qfanny: I wonder if this assumption would fit our Pod Squad. If we keepthe question in the context of Cry Your Name, I think that Max'sreaction (crying, upset) and everyone else's reaction was veryhuman. They look like humans, they talk like humans, but are theyhumans??? Or or they aliens. I am afraid to say it, but it seemsthat the scales tip to the Earthling side more the Podians. Butthat's just my assessment.

Yes! That's what I've been saying all along: their essences (souls) have been mixed with human genetic material (fertilized eggs, or one of Grandpa DuPris's stem cells..) to make our 8 pod people: Human bodies, alien souls. The blood thing may just be a side effect. The generium? Feh. Slightly OT: You all know that, to get a third season, we must send an impressive number of Tabasco Sauce bottles to TPTB at UPN? Don't forget to mention that, as Roswell fans, we'll insist that our cable systems add a UPN channel. Ours, for example, doesn't have one. And UPN is chronicly short of people who can see it: they have few stations, and those have little range. Lis is not an . Neither are the podsters.

Posted 04-26-2001 09:09 PM
InDNile
Addicted Fan
Posts: 747 Registered: Dec 2000 I posted this on the Behr board the other day to see if I got any ideas and so far no one has had anything to offer, so I thought I'd give it a shot over here quote:

OK, everyone--I just want it to be known exactly how "Nutz" thisbinary riddle is driving me!I was up most of last night trying to make some sense out of this.I came up with the same figures Terracore posted, he is absolutelycorrect regarding the the binary to decimal conversion. However,those numbers don't equate to anything meaningful.Examples:The ASCII codes for 1,2, and 3 are a white face, a black face anda heart(like on playing cards) respectively. Therefore, the 2-bitoffset arrangement can be deciphered using just those threesymbols, plus zero, which is null.The four-bit offset reads as: 14: Two tied eighth notes (musical) 4: A diamond (again, like on playing cards) 9: An open oval symbol 13: A single eighth note 9: See aboveThe five-bit offset reads as: 28: A math symbol, looks like a backwards "L" 18: A vertical 2-headed arrow symbol 14: The tied eighth note symbol 25: A vertical single headed (down) arrow

The ten and twenty bit offsets are well outside of ASCII range.Now, this is not where the story ends. . .in addition to ASCII, Itried to decipher them using EBCDIC, another type of characterset.I also tried converting the binary to Hexadecimal and Octal, butthe character translation in both ASCII and EBCDIC is nonsensicle.Nothing seems to make sense, and the sad thing is, this kind ofconversion is not new to me, and I don't generally regard it asbeing difficult.Lastly, Clint, I think I know what you are getting at about the7+1 bits, but all that does is allow you to drop the character setdown to the first 128 character, effectively lopping off thehigh-bit characters. This is primarily used in datacommunications, where symbols like boxes and circles are not sentin raw data format. I did, however, investigate this avenue aswell, you see the 20 bits WOULD equal two characters in a modemtransmission, because the communication hardware and software hasto append a start bit and a stop bit to the basic 8-bit character.Therefore, if you divide the twenty bits in half, then strip offthe first and last bit of each half, you are left with two 8-bitcharacters:

11001001 = Standard uppercase "I" 11101100 = The infinity symbolOf course, I don't think this is the right route because dividingthe string in half leaves a zero as some of the stop bits, andthis would not work--it would have to be a one.So, after many hours of scratching my head and staring, blearyeyed, at a legal pad, I am left wondering this:Does this really mean anything at all, or is it just random bitsthat they will SAY means this, that or the next thing? I hope theydidn't drop an important clue, and then not bother to have itchecked out by someone technical. . .I know that not just everyonecan do binary, decimal, hexadexcimal and octal conversions, buthey--I'm not THAT old, and there are a lot of people who still dothat kind of thing on a daily basis!PS: The symbolic characters referenced above are the "WindowsGeneration" equivelant to the original ASCII sysmbols thatoccupied those postions, but those traditional characters arecontrol codes (non-printing). If anyone is interested in thecontrol codes, let me know.

If anyone has any questions or suggestions, I'm all ears!------------------Don't hate me because I am beautiful, when there are so many other reasons. . .

Posted 04-26-2001 10:18 PM
thescoobygang

Ultimate Fan
Posts: 2050 Registered: Mar 00
quote:

originally posted by AlexEvans Just a thought... has anyone looked at Alex's computer? Could besomething there

I was thinking the same thing. Didn't Alex keep email correspondance with that girl in Swedan? If he did there could be something there. Or just the possibility of more binary numbers on file somewhere. If I were Liz I would get back to his room and check his computer. quote:

originally posted by alien_lover They mentioned The Matrix in this episode. Well for those who haveseen it know that the Matrix is in code. When you look at theMatrix all you see are 1's and 0's.

Yes, I think it was rather cool for them to mention The Matrix in this episode. Even if it doesn't mean anything the parallelism is funny to think about. In the movie, The Matrix is what exactly? It's an illusion...it's the wool pulled over your eyes so that you won't see the truth. And isn't that what Cry Your Name was about? Alex's death is an illusion of sorts----where nothing is what it seems. Liz thus becomes the truth seeker and just like in The Matrix, if you unlock the code you get to see behind the illusion.Scooby[This message has been edited by thescoobygang (edited 04-26-2001).]

Posted 04-26-2001 10:31 PM
Nemo
Addicted Fan
Posts: 799 Registered: Dec 99
Gender:M
quote:

Originally posted by RemyS: I sent [the code] out to two "mathematician" friends of mine. Oneof them responded (he is a bar code systems expert) and he says inthe decimal values of the binary code it is the following:1110 01
00 1001 1101 100114----4----9----13----9If this has already been determined, sorry. I don't have a clueyet as to what it could mean. Steff/RemyS

Several have posted this on various threads; still, it's informative to hear of one more expert who took the same approach (working with the long bit string as a succession of 4- or 8-bit segments, instead of all 20 bits at once). I thought this was the obvious first thing to try, so did another physicist colleague of mine, besides Steff's mathematician friend. If there was ever a time to invoke shapeshifter's axiom, this looks like it.So, if this is the right way to start, what next? Hooked posted above (p.1?) that in a certain ASCII character set, one gets:---- 1110 = Shift (or Shift Out)0100 1001 = I1101 1001 = `U ("U-grave")[I have left out the hex conversion that is a customary intermediate step, because that may have made things look more complicated and arbitrary than they really are.] These three characters still look to me like the best bet so far. This, or some minor variant -- such as the Unicode mentioned on the Liz thread, having "Device Control 4" instead of 'Shift" above. It looks as if this could be relevant, especially in view of rampant speculation (long before the code appeared) that Alex might sometimes be under alien control, or that someone else may have been substituted for him. Maria did say he came back from Sweden "a different man."Reasons why alternative ways to interpret the bits seem less plausible to me:1) As a single 20-bit binary integer? Hard to work out on the spur of the moment, without tables or calculator. Whereas one can picture Alex taking pride in knowing the ASCII character set from memory (in hex form, from which it would be easy enough for him to translate into binary on the fly).2) As octal numbers? Octal (3 bits) is an older system, seemingly much less used nowadays than hex (4 bits). (The latter being much more conveniently packed into 8-bit bytes which have ruled the computer scene since before Alex was born.)[This message has been edited by Nemo (edited 04-26-2001).]

Posted 04-26-2001 10:42 PM
shapeshifter
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1802 Registered: May 2000 I think it spells Kvar, and have just revamped my theory: Alex did 'commit suidcide' to prevent Kvar (who was doing the Temp on him) from harming Isabel.

Posted 04-26-2001 11:30 PM
PepperjackCandy
Addicted Fan
Posts: 682 Registered: Dec 2000 I know this isn't related to the whole binary conversion topic at hand, but I just thought of another SF topic covered by CYN that wasn't on the list at the beginning of the thread (or if it was, I apologize for missing it). The Ramifications of Changing History. FMax told Liz that Alex attended their wedding in 2002. So, unless TPTB are going to pull some kind of "return from the dead" thing from their hat, with CYN, we've really started seeing the results of FMax's attempt to change history.Footnote: I don't necessarily believe, btw, that EOTW necessarily changed things for the better, either. All we know is that FMax disappeared. That could have happened for any number of reasons -- the Podsters defeated the Skins and went back to PSAWN in triumph; separated from Liz, Max lost his ability to make good judgment calls, and let Michael and Isabel's hot-headedness make the decisions for him, and he died long before, 2014; etc.------------------Boarderlander * CHADDif it isn't complicated, he probably isn't a soul mate

Posted 04-27-2001 01
:16 AM
Jamethiel

Fan
Posts: 85 Registered: Jun 00
It has been a long time since I had something worthwhile to say, and a worthy episode to comment upon as far as the science fiction of Roswell goes...This is really a rumination on images of cold and hot in Roswell.COLD1)The verse that Maria chose to sing from Amazing Grace, is one that isn't sung often or known well. I don't remember the exact line but it refers to cold...2)Robert Frost, "stopping by the woods on a snowy evening"3)Alex "why does the food always have to be cold?"4)Max, "I didn't expect his body to be so cold."5)Alex is associated with a trip to Sweden (which is a cold, cold place).6) Alex in Wipe Out (his pancakes are cold...but if he experienced the true "timewarp" then no time should have passed (i.e. "warm pancakes"). Perhaps possessed Alex made himself scarce because he wasn't human even as far back as Wipe Out.7)Max talks about being "cold" and "wet" in "How the Other Half Lives" when dealing with the blue crystals.WARM1)In "Balance" Michael loses his balance from too much heat in the Indian sweats.2)Podster Aliens love tabasco "a hot sauce"3)Podsters and Granolyth are based in a desert region (Roswell, New Mexico) known for its hot summers4)the aliens crashed (allegedly) near the 4th of July, which leads to images of firecrackers, fireworks and heat.5)Ava's image of the crash on the silverhandprint site, is a desert...shifting sands like the Sahara6)Michael makes "hot buttered rum" for Amy!(I don't think its of significance..but fun to think about).

I think I've run out of comparisons this second, but the point is that the podster/humans tend to like heat to a point.That cold has tended not to be mentioned much (the one exception being "A Roswell Christmas Carol" where Michael talks about being cold)...and it snows at the end.I'm wondering from a science fiction point of view if these references don't point to the different planets that make up the podster homeworld alliance?Podsters=warm....someother alien/race = cold?On a side note, the frequent, frequent references to "Elvis" culminated in Max being crowned a "King" and a trip to Las Vegas. So I wouldn't overlook any words that are repeated so endlessly by the characters and in such different contexts.By the way..."I shall believe!"[This message has been edited by Jamethiel (edited 04-27-2001).]

Posted 04-27-2001 10:33 AM
LSS
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1618 Registered: Feb 00
Hi Jamethiel!Nice catch on the hot/cold motifs!LSS

Posted 04-27-2001 11:18 AM
RemyS
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 246 Registered: Mar 00
From what I have read, most of us concur that Alex did NOT commit suicide. But as Shapeshifter mentioned, it is possible if Kvar or "someone" (possibly to harm Isabel) had taken over his body, that he may indeed have sacrificed himself for her sake. Whatever the reasons may be, suicide would have to be a consideration if indeed Alex left clues around (such as the coded signature on the receipt) for others to find after his death. Why would he leave clues unless he KNEW that he was going to die, whether by his own hand or at the hand of another? You don't get cryptic if you plan to be around to easily explain what is going on. Did Alex know that he was going to die? If he did know (whether planned or unplanned by him), why leave such difficult and obscure clues? Why not just write a letter to Liz or Isabel? Was he afraid that whoever or whatever had possessed him would find out, thus foiling his plans? Or did that someone or something find out, and force Alex to swerve into the truck, thereby eliminating Alex? Gives a strong stance for possession, having Alex trying to secretly let someone know that it is NOT just him sharing his body. Another scenario is that Alex did NOT commit suicide and that the clues are NOT from him (as I've said before, you don't leave clues if you don't know or plan on dying). If there is a possession taking place, the clues could have been left by the possessor, left for others as messages, and have nothing to do with uncovering Alex' death. Liz may be on to something, but not necessarily ONLY the solving of Alex' death. Those clues may have something to do with much more than Alex or his demise.Steff/RemyS

Posted 04-28-2001 12:00 AM
shapeshifter
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1802 Registered: May 2000 RemyS, I see things as you do. To continue on with possibilities based on your premises: If Collin Hanks later wants to continue with the show, and if the show continues, it seems that given the burial of the body, the only way to 'resurect' him would be a time warp in which Liz gets in the Granolith and goes back to warn Alex! LSS, I remember you warned us last season about the hazards of time travel as a plot device, but surely this would be a worthy cause! [This message has been edited by shapeshifter (edited 04-28-2001).]

Posted 04-29-2001 03:46 PM
Nemo
Addicted Fan
Posts: 799 Registered: Dec 99
Gender:M
Speaking of timewarps: in Alex's room the camera shows us an "ANY TIME" sign (part of a NO PARKING sign) just like the one in Max's room in season 1 that hinted of time travel in the story to come.... [This message has been edited by Nemo (edited 04-29-2001).]

Posted 04-29-2001 06:50 PM
shapeshifter
Obsessed Fan
Posts: 1802 Registered: May 2000quote:

Originally posted by Nemo: Speaking of timewarps: in Alex's room the camera shows us an "ANYTIME" sign (part of a NO PARKING sign) just like the one in Max'sroom in season 1 that hinted of time travel in the story tocome....

Ooo! Good catch, Nemo! I flashed on that sign when it went by, but didn't make the connection.

Posted 04-29-2001 06:56 PM
Granolith
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 324 Registered: Oct 2000 Gender: F
About the Any Time sign. Interesting thoughts, but maybe they are just recycling props.Still liking this thread. Nothing intelligent to add.

Posted 04-29-2001 07:01 PM
Lameduck
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 200 Registered: May 00
I noticed the sign also. In fact since Kyle gets up and moves over to it, I assumed it was deliberate and the any time meant something. However, since his line is about things not being right, I took it to imply that mindwarps were going on and could happen at any time.

Posted 04-29-2001 09:00 PM
BehrFan
Addicted Fan
Posts: 955 Registered: Dec 99
quote:

Originally posted by ClaireBehr: When you take the numbers you guys found, 14-4-9-13-9 and linethem up with the alphabet (ex. 1=a, 2=b, 3=c ect.) You get theletters: N-D-I-M-I I don't know if that means anything but, it's worth a try. -Claire

I'm just being silly before bed time, but how about...Not Destiny, Instead Mindwraps (and) IllusionsAt least that's what I believe!Oh, and the Mom-o-gram...total and complete mindwrap...at least I hope it is!

Posted 04-29-2001 09:04 PM
BehrFan
Addicted Fan
Posts: 955 Registered: Dec 99

quote:

Posted 04-29-2001 09:14 PM
BehrFan
Addicted Fan
Posts: 955 Registered: Dec 99
quote:

Posted 04-29-2001 09:17 PM
BehrFan
Addicted Fan
Posts: 955 Registered: Dec 99
quote:

Posted 04-30-2001 06:01 AM
RemyS
Dedicated Fan
Posts: 246 Registered: Mar 00
Weird....There's a post not showing up here that was posted almost 12 hours ago. Let's see if this post gets this thread updated.Steff/RemyS

Posted 04-30-2001 07:29 PM
Nemo
Addicted Fan
Posts: 799 Registered: Dec 99
Gender:M
My wife has a theory about the binary code (I haven't checked to see if this is a new one or not) -- she thinks it's information that will allow our friends to use the Granolith, that Alex surreptitiously got this information out of whatever alien mind or machinery was trying to control him (just as last year he hacked into Ms. Topolsky's computer) and used the credit-card slip as a way of conveying the data to his friends (knowing it would be returned) without its being found among his papers and intercepted by the alien.

Posted 04-30-2001 08:14 PM
Qfanny
Crazed Fan
Posts: 1299 Registered: Jul 00
Nemo - I think I suggested it back on page one. Interesting how Liz used the code and linked it to the Leanne is not Leanne.------------------From NebraskaQfanny/MOB14Liz is not an alienApril 28th Kansas City Gathering

The Science Fiction of Cry Your Name Copyright Š Fan Forum 2001. All Rights Reserved.

The Science Fiction of Cry Your Name
Copyright Š Fan Forum 2001. All Rights Reserved.